Talk:The CBL
Caution, this discussion has become heated. Editor's are reminded to be civil. I will explain my edits; "The CBL is not in any way affiliated with Nexon" It is not, and I added that in there to clear it up. "The CBL often receives unwanted publicity because of some public ignorance as to the workings of the service." We are not aiming to shoot down the public. We are the public. Remember, this is a highly controversial subjecct, and we want to keep it as neutral as possible. Hunter *Talk*, Advertising Commitee 18:32, April 10, 2010 (UTC) Ok listen to me. The only reason this topic is producing any problems is because you are writing it in such a fashion. While using the word "ignorant" may not have been necessary, you deleted this section: Malicious users in Combat Arms often claim they have association with certain community administrators/staff members including CBL Staff. This gives some users the impression that The CBL Staff hand out favors and keep their friends clean while maintaining the ability to make someone CBL Dirty at the click of a finger. There is no method for deleting a report from The CBL; it will always be available as either "Voided" or "Confirmed" after the evaluation process. This means users who submit reports will be able to see all of their reports at all times. There has been no instance of someone maintaining a Clean status due to any connections with The CBL's staff. Additionally, the status of CBL Dirty can only be obtained with concrete in-game evidence. A player cannot just be declared Dirty in a similar manner to flipping a light-switch. There was absolutely no reason to delete this section and you are making the article less neutral than you are claiming. You leave in the part claiming that the CBL is corrupt with NO RELATED EVIDENCE while you actually delete the true paragraph. This is unacceptable and The CBL does not wish for there to be any problems between our services. We do not wish to need to continue talks with administrators of this web site in a negative light. I reverted the page to what it was last night. It would be nice if it could be locked so as not to be edited, although users could add more if they wish. S7Arby 17:55, April 11, 2010 (UTC) As this was official information requested by the administration of this site, no one else should have the ability to edit what was placed there, as they are subsequently making the information incorrect. CC FANG 10:44, April 11, 2010 (UTC) ---- I agree with S7, however clearly a consensus has to be made. A) We are not combat arms, and have no official affiliation with them. B)We write facts, and the whole truth, reguarded in such a manner when that is when proven, we use the word "is", or some other factual word, When we are taking advice on it, we assume good faith, but we dont make it concrete, i.e. "might be"; :"There has been no instance of someone maintaining a Clean status due to any connections with The CBL's staff." ::We cant prove this. So we could throw in a "confirmed" between the "no" and "instance". Lets make the page explore the positives and negative of the sight. Would you care to submit a section, explaining how the CBL work. The CBL page layout would be. general overview ---> how cbl's supposed to work ---> controversy (which would be cleaned up to imply that they mostly do a good job) ---> Trivia Hunter *Talk* 18:12, April 11, 2010 (UTC) ---- S7Arby I feel it would be more appropriate to continue this discussion with the administrators of this website. Thank you for offering your time, however. S7Arby 20:47, April 11, 2010 (UTC) Inappropriate Revisions Official Request to lock the information officially contributed by the CBL I agree this is best discussed with the primary administrator of this site. As CBL Operations Administrator, I would be the appropriate one to discuss this with on the CBL's end. The information I posted was completely factual. I did not attempt to remove the conspiracy theories, only changing them to say things like "alleged" since what was originally being expressed there was incorrect, yet stated as if it was factual; the only "evidence" being a video containing chat from a source which the uploader himself says is untrustworthy. Since this site and other wikia-style websites are generally meant to contain facts and observations not gossip and unfounded accusations, this seemed an appropriate correction to make. The information I posted contained only the most basic information about the CBL and what it does, after all this is the Combat Arms Wiki, not the CBL Wiki. Readers were invited to check out the website if they wanted further information, which would be a common practice, I am sure there are many links to other webpages, such as Nexon's, where readers can get more inforation on specific things. Labeling these links as "biased" is simply ridiculous, it is simply a link to the website. It is stated that it is the CBL website, so of course anything there would be written by the CBL Administration. I am not sure how a website can be biased toward itself through a simple link, and so those edits seem inflammatory and unnecessary. Now to address bias, H Fern is obviously biased against the Community Ban List and should refrain from editing this page. We are attempting only to contribute factual information and not to speak negatively against any group or player. He is doing selective editing to maintain an accusatory tone and I do not believe that type of post is the goal of the site creator. I officially request that the information I provided be locked and the public unable to edit it to prevent an inflammatory situation. Of course, the puublic could add what they wish subsequently under the current permissions allowing them to do so, but the text I provided, as the official contribution from the site, should ideally be unchangable. If it is edited, it is no longer official information from the source, which was the request presented to me. The administrator may contact me at the CBL site if they wish to verify the validity of this request, here is the page affirming my identity http://thecaconline.net/cbl/info/staff.html Thank you for your attention to this matter. Sincerely, CC_FANG CBL Operations Administrator CC FANG 03:44, April 12, 2010 (UTC) ---- a) I am not biased. But Ive heard many bad things from dear friends about the CBL. I am trying to be neutral, but this is a subject which is hard for me. b) Granted, I have used the CBL, and it helps to know whose clean or dirty. c) The article appears neutral now. Hunter *Talk* 13:47, April 12, 2010 (UTC) If this subject is a sore one with you, simply disqualify yourself from participating in the page edits. Of the things I "hear" from the community very little are based upon fact, instead it is grapevine-style sensationalism with hardly any factual content whatsoever. The only people who have an actual correct perception of how things work are staff members who have put in enough time to truly get familiar with CBL operations and policies. Without exception, each new staff member is impressed with the careful way in which reports are handled, and all the checks and balances built into the system, and the dedication and high standards of the management. Consider the possibility that your dear friend is misinformed and therefore your subsequent perception is also inaccurate. If you are satisfied with the information contained on the page now, then the subject seems moot, but I would still request the existing content on the page be locked due to the previously stated reasons. CC FANG 20:54, April 12, 2010 (UTC) ---- -'Bureaucrat ZeroExalted has arrived'- So you are official emissaries from the CBL, and you're aquitting Hunter (H_Fern) of being biased. And if he is indeed found guilty of such, he should not be permitted to add/fabricate baised information about the CBL on the CAWikia, correct? -- }} 12:25, April 14, 2010 (UTC) ---- "Lets Just All Get Along!" Yeah I made biased edits, yeah we should probably maintain relations with the CBL (for our benefit), and no the page shouldn't be deleted. The page looks fine as it is now. Lock it and throw away the key. =p -- Hunter *Talk* 13:51, April 14, 2010 (UTC) :EDIT: Zero, did you actually spell b'crat in long for? o.O Agree... Losing the key would be a good idea... I am not sure how I would be acquitting anyone of anything since no one has been convicted of any offense; and I am not in a position of authority on this site. I came across the CBL page and found it to be exceptionally unflattering, full of incorrect information which was partially intended to project a negative opinion to the public of the site, service, and its staff. If you similarly came across something that cast the Combat Arms Wiki in the same light, would you not at least try to resolve the situation? Upon reporting the issue, I was asked to correct the information, as there would be no better source than a CBL Administrator to ensure what was said was accurate. I tried to do this, and even left the negative aspects that were previously posted, merely altering them to show an opinion expressed rather than stating the allegations as fact, which they are not. Everything I posted is factual, and well-documented and common knowledge among the CBL community and its staff. My problem with the subsequent edits to what I had posted were twofold: *First, the edits were done selectively to maintain a negative tone and information removed that directly addresed some of the allegations in the previously existing negative content. *Secondly, I was posting as an official CBL source, and any edits by a non-CBL source then compromised the status as official information. Since the primary person who has been requesting revisions now seems satisfied, it would be great if the existing content could be locked. I have no problem with anyone posting anything to add, but please preserve what is there now, unaltered if that is possible. H Fern, you are in charge of advertising this site? CC FANG 14:28, April 14, 2010 (UTC) ---- Unfortunately, excuse the spelling im on a weird keyboard and pressed for time, I did make horrible judjement calls when editing the article. And yes, I am starting an advertising campaign, me of course being the self-proclaimed head of it. We're not getting far though. LOL 18:30, April 14, 2010 (UTC) Sorry i wasnt logged in. Hunter *Talk* 18:31, April 14, 2010 (UTC) Dear lord what happened to this talk page? I get off for a day and return to eight new messages and a totally new format for the discussion. If there happens to still be some issues with the page, could someone please clarify them for me since I really don`t understand the entire logic flow? SeaCrane_1 22:13, April 14, 2010 (UTC) ---- Here's the flow, and list of events leading up to this (in my opinion): #We had a controversial CBL page not appearing neutral #The CBL staff cought wind and seeked to correct it #An Editor (not CC) removed everything bad having to do w/ the CBL #I reverted the edits as unneeded, potentially spam #ect ect #I made some admittedly biased edits #CC FANG wrote about my edits, and submitted an official version #Hunter, made some spelling/grammar/technicality edits #Here we are today Hunter *Talk* 23:11, April 14, 2010 (UTC) I am formally withdrawing from this Discussion. Hunter *Talk* 23:35, April 14, 2010 (UTC) Advertising your site As I am sure you know, we have a very successful, busy site. If you would like to meet we can discuss the possibility of getting you some community exposure, if that is what you wish. We have many very knowledgable members, and we do a lot of research into the game as part of our evaluating process. If it is traffic and article contributions you are looking for, I may be able to help. Flle free to PM me at the CBL site (I'd rather not post contact info here, lol) CC FANG 23:42, April 14, 2010 (UTC) ---- Ive stepped down, as requested by my superiors, voluntarily for Discussion on The CBL page itself. But I am still Head of the Advertising Commitee. This now falls under the gray zone. I will, however, be happy to say that SeaCrane will be the official liaison between the CAWiki and The CBL if approved by ZeroExalted, our acting B'crat. I will still be monitoring this discussion, and commenting when necessary. It would probably be best if you knew that our wiki is very community based. We dont have very many official Policies and editors know eachother. When talking to each other it would probably be best to refer to CAW:EQUAL. Hunter *Talk*, Advertising Commitee 02:34, April 15, 2010 (UTC) Allrighty.. =) H Fern My offer was designed to extend the hand of friendship and show support for a community site. I extended it to you personally, because you are the head of the Advertising committee, but also in hopes of giving you a chance to get to know us a little better, and perhaps changing your previously negative opinion of us. If you'd rather not, that's fine, just know that the offer was made and still stands. All the best to you, CC FANG Sea Crane, I thank you sincerely for locking the page. Anything I can do in return please feel free to ask. CC FANG 09:19, April 15, 2010 (UTC) ---- It was no trouble at all, but right now, I`m not exactly at liberty to speak as ZeroExalted has yet to approve anything. Then again, he also has yet to get on today. Since your offer was a personal extension to H Fern and I know he`d be happy to accept it, I think it would be best to leave a message on his talk page to begin discussing any advertising plans. It`s wonderful to know that we have the support of the CBL on our side! SeaCrane_1 12:22, April 15, 2010 (UTC) Well, I must be off to school now. SeaCrane_1 12:38, April 15, 2010 (UTC) ---- =o Didnt mean to negate the offer. Sorry if it sounded that way. Its just im try to sound formal when normally I'm a fun loving guy. Most my talk page messages have a "lol" or two in them. Im trying to use the biggest words possible to sound good. =). So it sounds Like CC FANG's the Liaison? Here lets take a quick vote on it; Vote For Liaison Motion to make User:CC FANG official CAWiki - CBL Liaison: Support, as nominator. Hunter *Talk*, Advertising Commitee 13:47, April 15, 2010 (UTC) Darn, SeaCrane, you get all the action these days, >-> Well, I hope that relations between the CBL and the CAWikia will continue to improve in the future, and if you guys need anything (to be fixed, most likely), just ask us! }} 18:37, April 15, 2010 (UTC)